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The Many Faces of Janine
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brian_reilly
Ghosthead
Joined: Jan 18, 2002
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 Posted: Apr 19, 2003 12:36 PM
Okay, I don't have all the RGB episodes, mostly just the first season and a couple from seasons 2 and 3, and I'm about to head off to work, so I'm gonna try and explain this quickly.
The original Janine from season one is, without question, the best. She sounded like Janine from the movie, had that great fashion sense, short hair, and those wicked pointy glasses.
Then I just found an old tape where she has a different voice, and is a motherly figure, with long hair, round glasses, and yellow clothers.
Also, in "Janine, You've Changed", she still has a the voice of "motherly Janine", although it's a little better, and she has the pointy glasses and short hair. Same yellow clothes though.
So, I ask you, which order did the Janine's come in, and when were the changes made? Also, are there any other Janine's that I'm not aware of?
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Veedramon
Ghosthead
Joined: Feb 03, 2003
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 1:03 PM
(Evil laughter as Fritz realizes he can now pontificate at length...)
The original Janine, the gutsy, abrasive one with the pointy glasses and the voice of Laura Summer, was the Janine seen in Season One on ABC (1986) and in the sixty-five episodes shown in syndication in 1987.
But ABC hired a bunch of "experts" that told DiC that Janine was too harsh and unlikeable. Thusly, in Season Two (1987), she had longer hair and rounder glasses, and a new voice: Kath Soucie, who frankly made her sound like a cheerleader gooned on helium. Still, if you look closely in "Camping It Up", there's one scene where she has her glasses off and you can tell it's supposed to be the same character with a different haircut.
In Season Three (1988) her hair was even longer and they'd started to even draw her differently--taller and thinner. That was also when they started to put her in that goshawful pink flightsuit on occassion.
In Season Four (1989) she had the same haircut as Annie Potts in GB2, which had come out between Seasons Three and Four: it was wide but short, with a little tail at the end.
Season Five (1990) featured "Janine, You've Changed" as its opener, which explained all of the changes to the character within the context of the RGB continuity. They supposedly "changed her back" but she didn't look too different than before and she still had the Kath Soucie voice. She had her shortest cartoon haircut yet, short and a bit spikey; and yes, the pointy glasses finally came back.
And in the climactic Season Six (1991) she had a longer, curlier haircut.
I refer you to the Janine topic for my takes on her psychology...
_____________
--Dr. Fritz V. Baugh, Mad Scientist and Official Historian of Ghostbusters: West Coast Division
Also known as GBCentral's Doc Fritz
Visit The Digibusters Ectozone, home of the Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline!!!!! and the New Ghostbusters Timeline!. The Ectozone is a member of the GB Community Board
Also visit The Ghostbusters Fact List!
And read one of my Fan Fictions Pretty Please?
Egon and Janine Forever!!!
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get_her!
Ghosthead
Joined: Nov 13, 2002
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 1:32 PM
What was really bad was when the original look Janine had Kath Soucie's voice in Transylvanian Homesick Blues  
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"I have a plan, I know exactly what to do. Alright, stay close. Stay close. I know. Do as exactly as I say. Ready, ready...GET HER!"
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Orko Is King
Ghosthead
Joined: Jan 21, 2003
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 4:03 PM
Can someone put up comparison pics of the the various Janine incarnations?
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I hate the yellow hose. It looks stupid.
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Ludicris
Ghosthead
Joined: Oct 12, 2002
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 4:39 PM
thats a good idea orko.
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please, no applause.
Ghostbusters: West Coast Division
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Doc Ryedale
Ghosthead
Joined: Nov 02, 2002
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 7:29 PM
Well done, Veedramon. 
I have a question about that irrating, annoying, awful helium-inhaling Kathy Soucie.
When they decided to make Janine into the kid-friendly mother figure, did they just get rid of Laura Summer, so they could replace her voice with a "new" kid-friendly voice? Or did she just quit on her own? Because that would've have been so mean and stupid to have fired her because her voice didn't match up with the "Crappy" new Janine.
Laura Summer as Janine Melnitz:   Perfect!
Kathy Soucie as Janine Melnitz:    AAAAAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!! YUCK!!!!!!!!! NO MORE HELIUM!!!!!!! NO MORE HELIUM!!!!!!! 
_____________
"We're on a mission from God!"
"Hey, do you believe in God? Well I do. Praise the Lord and pass the Particle Throwers! I love Jesus' style. . . "
"Back off, man, I'ma Genealogist!"
They don’t just call them The Real Ghostbusters for no reason! Take a look at Take Two, Citizen Ghost, The Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline, THE GHOSTBUSTERS FACT LIST, and RGB Truly Canon with the Movies?, and you’ll see why!
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Veedramon
Ghosthead
Joined: Feb 03, 2003
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 8:25 PM
I wish I knew which order the carts and horses were in this case; I've heard seperately (though these were second and thirdhand sources) that Lorenzo Music quit and J. Straczysnki quit as story editor because of the changes ABC wanted made to the characters; I haven't heard whether Laura Summer similarly quit in disgust, though of the three I'd consider it the most possible that she was fired. But again, I don't know that for sure.
"Transylvania Homesick Blues" aired in syndication, but featured Dave Coulier and Kath Soucie. Again, not something I know for certain, but my guess is that it was the first Season Two episode made, and ABC went "No, we want you to change her look, too." so it ended up in syndication. But again, only a guess.
And just for fairnesses sake, to keep this from being a "let's beat up on Kath Soucie" thread, she's been in other shows and didn't do too badly. I'm pretty sure I even saw an episode of Tiny Toon Adventures where we discover she can, indeed, do a Brooklyn accent ...it could just be that Kath wasn't allowed to be a better Janine.
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--Dr. Fritz V. Baugh, Mad Scientist and Official Historian of Ghostbusters: West Coast Division
Also known as GBCentral's Doc Fritz
Visit The Digibusters Ectozone, home of the Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline!!!!! and the New Ghostbusters Timeline!. The Ectozone is a member of the GB Community Board
Also visit The Ghostbusters Fact List!
And read one of my Fan Fictions Pretty Please?
Egon and Janine Forever!!!
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Kingpin
Ghosthead
Joined: Aug 17, 2001
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 8:33 PM
This is why they should either ask the fans, or never hire quote on quote "Experts", they don't know anything, only the fans know what to do, and slightly off topic.
Didn't you hate the way the flooring in the Firehouse's Garage became shiney circular tiles in the time of GB2 Janine style? When it had been something like rough brickwork in the earlier eps.
_____________
"We have the tools, we have the talent"
The sun never sets on the British Empire...because God can't trust us in the dark! evil grin
Nightsquad gets chatting
Egon and Janine forever! Everything else is wrong
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brian_reilly
Ghosthead
Joined: Jan 18, 2002
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 9:50 PM
Yeah Kingpin, but I guess the "new and improved" Janine thought that they should tile the floor.
Oh, and JMS has stated that he quit in disgust, was begged to return but couldn't, and then returned to do a few eps (like Janine, You've Changed). It's odd that he didn't choose to explain the change in voices of Peter and Winston in that episode.
_____________
Canadian Ghostbuster
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Doc Ryedale
Ghosthead
Joined: Nov 02, 2002
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 10:27 PM
Sorry. I know she's done great in other things. Like Rugrats!
But that would have been so mean to have fired Laura Summer.
_____________
"We're on a mission from God!"
"Hey, do you believe in God? Well I do. Praise the Lord and pass the Particle Throwers! I love Jesus' style. . . "
"Back off, man, I'ma Genealogist!"
They don’t just call them The Real Ghostbusters for no reason! Take a look at Take Two, Citizen Ghost, The Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline, THE GHOSTBUSTERS FACT LIST, and RGB Truly Canon with the Movies?, and you’ll see why!
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brian_reilly
Ghosthead
Joined: Jan 18, 2002
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Posted: Apr 19, 2003 10:28 PM
Actually Veedramon, I had already read that Janine topic (and posted in it a couple of times) and had a question for you about it:
Do you think that the reason for Janine's XGB incarnation (a cross between #1 and #2) is because, after 10 years, her incomplete transformation to Lotsabucks has faded somewhat?
In theory, I would think that it would have faded rather quickly, as most of the other transformations in the series did, however, her constant exposure to ectoplasmic energy (from working with the GBs, and Slimer) caused the transformation to become more permanent.
_____________
Canadian Ghostbuster
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brian_reilly
Ghosthead
Joined: Jan 18, 2002
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Posted: Apr 20, 2003 1:14 PM
Did Laura Summer quit or get fired? Hmmm, good question. Lorenzo Music and JMS quit after certain changes were made, so maybe Laura Summer did too. While I can't say for sure, it seems more likely to me that she quit, rather than be part of the destruction of a well-developed and beloved character.
JMS was very proud of the Janine character from season 1 of RGB. He had a right to be proud too, as he created her from virtually nothing (Annie Potts has very few lines in the original GB). In fact, I would argue that Laura Summer and JMS developed the definitive Janine character.
Alas, it happens with many shows where a beloved character (or characters in the case of the Dukes of Hazzard) is replaced by less than suitable actor/actress, in this case Kathy Soucie. I simply cannot stand to watch any episode with Kathy Soucie in it, not because she was a bad actress, but simply because she was a bad Janine (again, possibly because she was hired to be a bad Janine). You can tell that in time, as JMS was brought back, Kathy Soucie made improvements to her version of Janine, but she could never replace Laura Summer.
Kathy Soucie is not a bad actress, however, we will never like her in RGB because she was not the original Janine, and, most likely, simply wasn't allowed to be a good Janine until it was too late.
Janine was my favorite RGB character growing up, and still is today. She, when played by Annie Potts (GB1 anyways) or Laura Summer, is well-developed, headstrong, intelligent, witty, and brash. She has a unique fashion sense and is not afraid to speak her mind. This is why I, and many of you, cannot stand the motherly Kathy Soucie version.
_____________
Canadian Ghostbuster
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-Instruction manuals for GB videogames!
-The most complete Ghostbusters Price Guide ever!
-The entire Real Ghostbusters Soundtrack in MP3 form!
-Ghostbusters and Ghostbusters II Shooting Scripts!
-Now part of a Community Owned Message Board!
-Too much to list!
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Doc Ryedale
Ghosthead
Joined: Nov 02, 2002
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Posted: Apr 20, 2003 3:38 PM
Yeah, that's what I was trying to say, Kathy Soucie was a Great Actress, but she was a HORRIBLE Janine Melnitz. She's done great in stuff other than RGB.
I never noticed very much difference between Arsenio Hall's voice and Buster Jones' Voices. Though, there was a slight difference. And Arsenio was so much funnier. Especially combined with Lorenzo Music's humor. They made Peter and Winston a Truly Funny Comical Duo on RGB.
*Dramatic Pipe Organ Music begins to play*
And now, one of the worse changes made to RGB we've all been waiting to discuss. . .
DAVE COULIER!
Alright, not to beat him up , but I could NEVER, NEVER, NEVER stand that Guy in anything, except for Muppet Babies. I REPEAT nothing but Muppet Babies. But I especially couldn't stand him as Dr. Peter Venkman on RGB. In fact, I never found him to be funny at all. Instead, I just found him to be annoying. He was one of these guys who thought he was funny, but in reality, he's not. I couldn't stand to "listen" to him as Peter.  He didn't have that classic Lorenzo Music (RIP) Voice, of course. And he never could've made the same one-liners and cracks that Lorenzo's Venkman could. Of course, that may have been do to the fact of those changes that were made. You know, Dave's Venkman sounded like he was choking on a Coke, with his lips puffed out!
But my question is why couldn't they have found a better actor/voice for Peter than Dave, after Lorenzo left? Oh, and by the way, if Dave ever plans on playing Dr. Peter Venkman in any other future RGB cartoons, should there be any, I've got three words for him:
Cut, It, Out!
EDIT: I'm sorry if got carried away. Please don't anyone get angry at me.
_____________
"We're on a mission from God!"
"Hey, do you believe in God? Well I do. Praise the Lord and pass the Particle Throwers! I love Jesus' style. . . "
"Back off, man, I'ma Genealogist!"
They don’t just call them The Real Ghostbusters for no reason! Take a look at Take Two, Citizen Ghost, The Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline, THE GHOSTBUSTERS FACT LIST, and RGB Truly Canon with the Movies?, and you’ll see why!
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Kingpin
Ghosthead
Joined: Aug 17, 2001
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Posted: Apr 20, 2003 6:16 PM
Heck no Ryedale, you spoke my mind perfectly. Lorenzo was and will always be Dr. Peter Venkman, as well as Garfield the Cat.
_____________
"We have the tools, we have the talent"
The sun never sets on the British Empire...because God can't trust us in the dark! evil grin
Nightsquad gets chatting
Egon and Janine forever! Everything else is wrong
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Veedramon
Ghosthead
Joined: Feb 03, 2003
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Posted: Apr 20, 2003 7:21 PM
Do you think that the reason for Janine's XGB incarnation (a cross between #1 and #2) is because, after 10 years, her incomplete transformation to Lotsabucks has faded somewhat?
Yeah, that's kinda my theory too. (Sorry I was a little slow in responding--I've been having some technical difficulties this weekend). One of the things I think XGB did right (remember, I'm not one of the rabid haters of that show like Doc ) was NOT getting Kath Soucie back for it, though I think we all would've liked it better if they'd gotten Laura back. Pat Musick didn't do too badly, I thought...
As I mentioned on the aforementioned Janine thread, she's one of my favorites and found it frustrating because, as she was technically not a Ghostbuster, didn't get as much screen time. Which is why Kath Soucie and GB2 ticked me off so bad: I felt like she was being badly mistreated. JMS had every right to be proud of that character and annoyed at how badly ABC wanted to lobotomize her.
To put in my 2 cents or so on Dave Coulier: about the only thing approaching sense in his hiring is that maybe somebody thought his mediocre Bill Murray impression was actually good...but like Kath Soucie he had the misfortune of following an actor who made the character very much his own (no mean feat, considering Lorenzo had to deal with Bill Murray's huge shadow)
Buster Jones had a slightly easier time of it, because he at least kind of sounded like Arsenio; I honestly think of the three "scabs" his was the smallest drop-off in terms of ability.
_____________
--Dr. Fritz V. Baugh, Mad Scientist and Official Historian of Ghostbusters: West Coast Division
Also known as GBCentral's Doc Fritz
Visit The Digibusters Ectozone, home of the Ghostbusters Omnibus Timeline!!!!! and the New Ghostbusters Timeline!. The Ectozone is a member of the GB Community Board
Also visit The Ghostbusters Fact List!
And read one of my Fan Fictions Pretty Please?
Egon and Janine Forever!!!
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brian_reilly
Ghosthead
Joined: Jan 18, 2002
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Posted: Apr 20, 2003 10:03 PM
Buster Jones had a slightly easier time of it, because he at least kind of sounded like Arsenio; I honestly think of the three "scabs" his was the smallest drop-off in terms of ability.
I agree that Dave Coulier was not that great a Pete Venkman (but hey, as Veedramon said, big shoes to fill). As I said before, Kath Soucie really ticked me off, but again, due to the face that she was probably forced to portray Janine in a crappy way.
As for Buster Jones, the fact that he sounded so much like Arsenio Hall, incredibly like him actually, always kind of irks me whenever I see an episode with him in it. It upsets me to know that he's, quite obviously, not doing an Ernie Hudson impersonation, but an Arsenio Hall impersonation.
I won't even get into my thoughts on the incarnations of Slimer (incoherent, semi-coherent, coherent, intelligent)
_____________
Canadian Ghostbuster
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-Instruction manuals for GB videogames!
-The most complete Ghostbusters Price Guide ever!
-The entire Real Ghostbusters Soundtrack in MP3 form!
-Ghostbusters and Ghostbusters II Shooting Scripts!
-Now part of a Community Owned Message Board!
-Too much to list!
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